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Jenica Atwin leaving Green Party, crossing floor to Liberal Party

Jenica Atwin leaving Green Party, crossing floor to Liberal Party

GrandBill

I had written another comment but I'm changing it to: wtf?


spacedoubt69

Feared this would happen. Annamie Paul, this is on you.


adzerk1234

She is doing exactly what she planned, stop being such typically naive Canadian, accept that, and get rid of her and her network.


spacedoubt69

Pardon?


DornishPirate

This party is falling apart. I voted for Atwin and might vote for her again as a Liberal. If not, I’m taking a good hard look at the NDP (because let’s face it the liberals are awful but I like Atwin). I blame Paul and her advisors, this is a mess.


digitalscrapheap

The Liberals are awful, that’s for sure. What does it say about her that that’s who she has crossed the floor to?


DornishPirate

If it was NDP her political career would be guaranteed over. There’s no support in NB, unfortunately. And the NDP has shown little interest in gaining that support.


digitalscrapheap

Fair enough, but therein lies the problem for me.


UncleIrohsPimpHand

Could you elaborate on this point?


digitalscrapheap

Sure. My opinion is that politicians become more concerned with remaining elected than actually affecting change. Years of watching Canadian politics tells me that elected officials don’t change the system, the system changes them.


IamTheOne2000

She's looking at the long term, and knowing that the NDP isn't going anywhere in that province, and she doesn't agree with Annamie Paul's leadership, she knows that she'll have a better chance of being re-elected, as a Liberal. ​ I'm not saying that I agree. But that's the way it is.


digitalscrapheap

I totally get it, I just feel like it’s representative of a lot of what I don’t like in politics. It is what it is. May she succeed in her career.


neoliberalismkills69

She crossed the floor as a sell out. Taking money over caring for the environment.


digitalscrapheap

Might be the case. Does confirm my prior perception of the Green Party being closer to the Liberals than the NDP. I joined to vote for Dimitri, Amita, and Meryam. Oh well.


neoliberalismkills69

Amita is my hero, they are amazing. Can't agree with Dimitri or Hadad though they have done more detriment than good for the Green Party of Canada. Edit: fix name typo


digitalscrapheap

Dimitri OR Lascaris?


neoliberalismkills69

Oops I meant Hadad


Affectionate-Chips

Her leaving the Green party is absolutely understandable, and maybe will be a bit of a wakeup call to all those who voted for a leader with zero chance of sitting in Parliament, and who has surrounded herself with the kinds of people dedicated to tearing the party apart like this.


neoliberalismkills69

Walking over to a party of neoliberals that whips votes into party lines what a clown Jenica Atwin has proved to be 🤡


Affectionate-Chips

It really sounds like you just didn't follow this story at all? Did you expect her to stay with the Green Party? Did you expect her to just go sit as an independent? What did you actually want here?


neoliberalismkills69

Sounds like you didn't follow the story. She pleaded issues with Annamie over Isreal statement then defected to Liberals and changed anyway. No she wouldn't sit as independent she is still new to politics and has no idea what she is doing, she has been relying on May this whole time; holding her hand and guiding her. She is cynical.


Affectionate-Chips

The NDP doesn't accept floor crossers, the Liberals are very literally her only option


moneenerd

It's pretty odd that someone who was so vehemently opposed to the Trans Mountain pipeline would join the very party that's pushing for it. Sure running independent would be hard but to make a deal with the devil comes off as incredibly opportunistic.


KillerKian

I'm right there with you friend!


McNasty1Point0

She has more influence as your local MP being a part of the governing party. If you like her, vote for her! That’s the way it should be anyway.


DornishPirate

Yeah, you’re right but I’d be voting for the guy that bought a pipeline and is litigating indigenous children 🤷‍♂️


anarchyrecoil

You’re only voting for that guy if you live in Papineau and vote for him


DornishPirate

Yes, I understand how our electoral system works. The fact remains that its one more seat towards his majority government.


anarchyrecoil

I guess. We’ll see how she votes.


EdsonFoothills

maybe time to just fold the Greens? honestly


IamTheOne2000

People have been talking about a Green/NDP merger for years, I’m surprised it hasn’t taken place yet.


EdsonFoothills

but it seems more likely a Green/Liberal merger.


Bodysnatcher

Less of a merger, and more like being swallowed whole.


IamTheOne2000

Not sure if the Liberal Party membership would agree to it....


EdsonFoothills

I mean, they just need two more MPs to jump their way and it's done :P


armagin

Not gonna happen. NDP benefits from a strong green party. Most accessible votes for both parties are in the LPC and CPC.


UncleIrohsPimpHand

I don't think this is true.


armagin

The numbers don't lie, go read the detailed polling next election cycle.


UncleIrohsPimpHand

So, you want me to wait until 2024 for you to actually back up your point?


armagin

I guess? Its been the same the last 2 cycles at least. If you can find some old polling reports on pools of accessible voters you'll see the same thing.


UncleIrohsPimpHand

So at what point is a strong Green Party good for the NDP?


armagin

Because the Green Party generally saps more support from LPC and CPC than NDP. Accessible voters are those who would even consider voting for your party. If the Green party is looking at the largest "potential voter pools" (ie. accessible voters) their best bet is looking within the LPC, followed by the CPC and finally the NDP. For the NDP their best bet is LPC, CPC, GPC in that order. I think it was angus reid that did the report on pools of accessible voters last election, but I don't think its available right now, and / or its buried deep on their site.


moneenerd

Soon as Elizabeth left, I lost interest, for sure.


neoliberalismkills69

May is an inspiration to me. I love that woman.


Hyacin75

This really breaks my heart ... and the fact that it is a direct result of the actions of our leader's office, and inaction of our leader ... I don't even ... it's just, so demoralizing. Makes me want to throw in the towel on this whole 'battle' and just go get my orange card. This whole situation is so unreal.


mightygreenislander

Waves from a Party that likes to win elections and has good environmental policies


holysirsalad

Has good environmental policies: GPC Likes to win elections: LPC, CPC not much overlap there


mightygreenislander

Plenty of New Democrats want to win elections. We would love to have the non dummies in the GPC join us. Not like being in a Party of losers run by dummies has ever changed anything!!!


KillerKian

Protip; When recruiting, it helps to not insult the people you're trying to recruit...


mightygreenislander

Upvoted because you're right, but also, I think it doesn't serve the GPC at all to minimize this self-inflicted shit show! Undoubtedly Jenica is leaving because Annamie hires a "strategist" who attacked her in the press. Why was such a dumbass ever paid by your under-resourced Party?!? Just because Annamie was able to win the Leadership doesn't mean she should be allowed to spend you donations hiring idiots who hurt the Party ... This kind of unprofessional crap would NEVER fly in any other federal Canadian political Party, and I don't think it helps Greens one bit to pretend this isn't something VERY sick in your Party's political culture.


holysirsalad

> login to Green party subreddit > call everyone losers > say they'll be welcome at the NDP We want to win elections too. Outside of BC or the vote-split that Alberta had (neither parties give any shits about the environment, btw) neither party actually does. I mean, if the NDP stood for what we value, the GPC wouldn't exist...


hards04

That party does not exist in Canada.


mightygreenislander

You are welcome to go down with a sinking ship of election losers like Elizabeth and Annamie! Just don't say you weren't offered a life boat!


ArnieAndTheWaves

Not many people could have done what Elizabeth did with this party. Going from 0 to 3 MPs is a huge feat in FPTP.


mightygreenislander

Raising and spending like $0.85 on the dollar that Jagmeet Singh between the time he became Leader and the 2019 election, yet elect 1/8 the MPs. I see why \*Elizabeth\* wants to spin that as a success, but I am super confused as to how hard-working, political saavy Greens would let her spit in their faces like that.


[deleted]

PEI New Democrats shouldn’t brag about winning anything. Unless you’re Herb.


UncleIrohsPimpHand

Can't say I blame her given the Zatzman stuff.


IamTheOne2000

It's a very sad and frustrating experience. After what was the best election result in the party's history, the next few elections won't be too kind to the Green Party. Leadership has ruined this party for at least the next decade.


StevenGrimmas

That convention was a disaster! I joined the Green Party, got very excited and then.. yeah... wasn't happy.


UncleIrohsPimpHand

She was such a star too.


IamTheOne2000

Yup, this is going to haunt the federal Green Party for a very long time. I'm guessing that there's going to be a lot of background pressure for Annamie Paul to resign, it's not going to work for her to pretend as if everything is going okay.


kochier

I mean the liberals aren't going to be much better on the Isreal/Palestine issue, but at least they won't have senior advisors actively working against their MP's getting elected.


Reso

There totally is internal politicking/undermining in the Liberal party. What was weird about the Zatzman case was that he did it so publicly. Probably because he doesn't respect the Greens as an organization and was just visiting from the Liberals anyway.


Affectionate-Chips

What was really weird about it was that he wasn't fired immediately


jayjaywalker3

This one hurts.


IamTheOne2000

I’m listening to the press conference, and while she gives the standard “I have a great respect for Anamie Paul”, she admits that she didn’t consult with Annamie Paul regarding her crossing of the floor. What a mess.


UncleIrohsPimpHand

Why consult a leader who has effectively slipped into the Shadows after winning to let her advisors run amok?


KillerKian

Given Paul's silence the last couple weeks, even if Atwin had reached out to her before making this move it seems like Paul would have just left her on read!


up_ktown

Been a proud Green supported for many years, and will continue to support the Greens of my province, but I'm seriously considering leaving this party. My membership is good until the middle of 2022, but I probably won't renew. The way I feel today, If I had a physical membership card on hand I would rip it up.


_-_happycamper_-_

At this rate that membership will be good long enough to vote in the next leadership election.


hards04

Wow. We’re fucked. Totally and completely fucked.


Ricky_5panish

I felt like something was up because her website hasn’t had mention of the Green Party for months. I wasn’t sure if this was intentional or not.


BuffaloHustle

Brutal. Annamie is a disgrace.


midnightmoose

This kills me - I legit believe that Atwin would have been the next leader of the Green Party after Paul inevitably was stepped aside for being unable to win a seat in the upcoming election.


Wightly

She should have resigned after not winning the by-election. "We came second" honestly doesn't cut it


Bucksavvy

I specifically joined the green party to support scientists in politics, there are enough lawyers and economists. One criteria I looked for was a reasonable stance on mining (we still need resources for green technology) and wrote off Paul because of her blanket statement against it. I'm glad I didn't vote for her, but very disheartened to see just how effectively she has driven off an MP with a background as an educator. The Green party has taken a turn for the far worse.


Wightly

I'm with you and didn't vote for her either.


MEME_SPOUTER69

Over 50% of the party voted for a status quo candidate to lead. People like Jenica are asking themselves, if I am going to be attacked internally for challenging the status quo as a Green, why don't I just join the status quo party? At least then I have a political future. Don't forget, she put her whole career and her future earning potential at risk in order to be a Green MP. If we can't work out a clear message to issues without public infighting, are we even mature enough as a party to even be able to compete for more seats in parliament? While Annamie would be a great MP I don't think she's up to the task to figure this all out. I hope she proves me wrong.


holysirsalad

> Over 50% of the party voted for a status quo candidate to lead. People like Jenica are asking themselves, if I am going to be attacked internally for challenging the status quo as a Green, why don't I just join the status quo party? At least then I have a political future. That's a little disingenuous based on how our ballots work. Runoff continues until a majority is reached. Little over a quarter actually really wanted her in that role. In terms of first-choices she only had about a 500 vote lead over the most radical candidate. Her vote share did not change until the 4th round, which to me says a lot about how she was prioritized by the other 74% of voting Greens. Dimitri Lascaris had a marginal lead in 4th and 5th rounds. At that point it was the *8th round* which is so far down people's ballots it might as well have been the result of a coin toss. The votes don't even add up at that point so a bunch of people didn't want either of them. So while Annamie Paul technically won, it's not fair to portray Greens as being largely status-quo. Shit, the two ex-Liberals, whom both seem more progressive than Annamie, commanded almost 23% of first choices. Better criticism I think is federal council that let this shit languish. This kind of internal governance crap is exactly what that organ is for and they just let the party lose a third of its seats. What I'd like to know is what was going on in that regards and whether there was any communication at all with the Leader's Office, or if they were in on it, or what.


MEME_SPOUTER69

At the end of the day if you put a number next to their name, you voted for them. The two names on the last ballot were ultimately carrying the flags for their respective voting blocs. At this point there is no questioning that this is a divided party and if you are curious as to where the leader stands, ask yourself what she has done since she has become leader and what she has shown to be her vision for the party and it will become painfully clear. The question is, do voters, party members, and now even MPs support this vision? Is it going to lead to a broader, more effective Green movement within this country?


GrandBill

Hard to fathom leaving a party for not supporting you in being pro-Palestine to join a party that is LESS pro-Palestine. I look forward to Jenica saying, the next time Trudeau says something vague and weaselly on the Israel-Palestine issue, that his comments are 'totally inadequate' (as she did with Annamie) and exclaim "end Apartheid!" on social media. I think she will have bigger problems with the PM's office than she did with Annamie's. I'd like to say 'we'll see' but I'm wagering that Jenica will have a lot less to say on this issue in the future.


GameDoesntStop

Hope she likes getting whipped.


holysirsalad

IDK why people are downvoting you, it's pretty well documented that the Liberals have a party whip and MPs aren't allowed to have individual opinions on certain matters. I feel like a lot of political hopefuls get all starry-eyed and drink the party KoolAid thinking they'll be able to make a difference. Then one day a few years later they're being forced to support something awful or lose their careers. Unfortunately this action symbolizes a compromise on most Green values in exchange for being in office, whether she knows it or not


BertramPotts

Absolutely but not whipping MPs isn't all that meaningful if the Leader's advisor is openly threatening to defeat them for their positions. Zatzman's post was really the kind of conversation an MP would expect to hear AFTER defying the whip.


JohnStamosBitch

Dimitri we miss u


Wightly

Speak only for yourself. He isn't the leader because more people wanted someone else. We would be in the same mess with him as leader. He would let religion get in the way of running the party. He can't stop talking about the M.iddle East


JohnStamosBitch

>He isn't the leader because more people wanted someone else if you mean he isnt the leader because Elizabeth may campaigned for a different candidate, who still barely beat him - even with the whole party's support then yea sure


BONUSBOX

if she's switching to the libs, is it really "crossing the floor?"


Bucksavvy

I appreciate your joke about the parliamentary seating arrangements, but I think it went over a few heads...


allocapnia

I think the Green Party would do a lot more than just talk about green issues.


neoliberalismkills69

Jenica Atwin is a sell out. She won't support the environment working for the libtards.


Ricky_5panish

The party failed her, to be honest. She made historic progress for them and they wouldn’t even give her a place at the symbolic head table.


Wightly

How is she a sellout when the party leader (who, for the record doesn't hold a seat in Parliament) let her underling threaten her career. We are letting Atwin down, not the other way around


Affectionate-Chips

She didn't sell out, she was very clearly pushed out.