T O P

Sure sure

Sure sure

TinManGrand

Do we really need to have a flame war about this? *Big Name Director Says Negative or Passive Aggressive Thing About Marvel Movies* Every few months we get a headline like this.


Okaythatwasepic

Should there be a flame war? No. An ironic declaration of war between r/marvelmemes and r/villeneuvememes which helps both subreddits gain followers? Absolutely


[deleted]

To arms!!


WaitingToBeTriggered

UNDER ONE BANNER


Cooke8008

Bruce?


Milkyasshole69

It's been five years


TreeBeeTurkey014

You still owe me $16


NarutoFan007

And I'll give it to you, when I have that kind of money lying around.


DarKav1411

You’ll get your money when you fix this damn door!


InfiniteShocker

F\*ck off


WhatsTheHoldup

It's Professor Hulk to you.


Wilsonrolandc

The Credible Hulk


ShasOFish

/r/unexpectedsabaton


Jkr0205

As a unit we stand and united we fall


EmergencyAdvance

Ruffalo or Norton?


RoxSteady247

On your left!


jgauth2

The spice must flow


Ariviaci

You have my sword.


Jjzeng

I thought that was a sub for memes about villeneuve the f1 driver and was thoroughly confused for a moment


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GuruWizardMan

People are simple and despite the plethora of reasonable fans there still is that war of "All marvel movies are good" vs "All marvel movies are bad"


CheeTaHOO7

Only a sith deals in absolutes.


LunarFortune

That sounds like an absolute to me


Zzzzzzzzzzip

Absolutely.


TymStark

Stating an absolute is not dealing in absolutes. Don't ever take a pot shot like this at Space Jesus ever again. You've been warned *ignites lightsaber*....its blue.


LunarFortune

You will try to stop me


theNoah_99

Anakin... why?!


WrassleKitty

https://youtu.be/gH10DQstVt4


-layner-

Because of obi-wan?


WhiskeySorcerer

Unexpected r/prequelmemes


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ILOVEMCU

I’m guessing he was a direct question and he answered it. Plus it would be weird not to have an opinion on the current #1 Hollywood money making machine.


caniuserealname

The question he was asked had nothing to do with Marvel specifically, if thats what you mean. The interveiw is in french, but the gist of it is that the interveiwer said something along the lines of "big movies are part of a franchise these days, this goes against the idea of the artist, don't you think Dune is choosing the franchise over the artist?" To which Denis responds that so long as you can feel personality in the film its personal, and then brings up Marvel, stating that the movies are produced from the same mould and while the filmmaker can add some color, they're all the same, but his film is completely personal. He also then goes on to claim he made the movie as broadly appealing as possible and tried to be mainstream with the movie.. which seems a bit tonedeaf considering it was part of the same reply. but thats besides the point i suppose.


Freaks-Cacao

I can't help but imagine his PR team panicking when he tried to say his movie was artisty and make hand movements to ask him to correct that. I went to a few film festivals as a professional and you can literally see that happen all the time.


ILOVEMCU

Yeah that’s a weird way to sell a high cost movie


Fyodor_Brostoevsky

This isn't true. The interview was in Spanish, not French. It was for El Mundo. And he was specifically asked by Scorsese's take on Marvel.


ShotIntoOrbit

Don't know what interview you read but the interview is in Spanish and the interviewer specifically asks him about Scorsese's comments on the matter.


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Nothingaddsup

It's not wrong though. I enjoy the MCU, but the films are incredibly safe, especially if it's the first film of a hero. It's why I really liked Netflix's Marvel shows. They pushed the boundaries way more and it was fresh.


EgnlishPro

I often compare MCU movies to romantic comedies. I used to say that I can't stand romantic comedies because they always follow the same formula: Guy and girl meet, guy falls for girl, guy makes mistake, guy makes up for it, guy and girl get together. The same thing can be said for most hero movies though. Hero is established, hero meets bad guy, hero wins. There is a bit of comfort in expecting how the story will turn out. I still don't like romantic comedies, but I can understand anyone who does like them.


SonovaVondruke

There are three basic plot “shapes” that the vast majority of films (and especially superhero films) follow: “A man falls in a hole”: guy fucks up or has something bad happen to him, has to find his way out of bad situation (and usually redeem the mistake) to (new) status quo as hero. “Boy meets girl” or in this case “Boy gets powers”: hero gains powers, things are awesome for a bit, he makes mistake, consequences are bad, redeems himself and reaches new status quo as hero. (This is the same formula/shape romcoms use) “Cinderella”: Down on his luck guy is given everything he needs to succeed by luck or a benefactor. Things seem to be going exceedingly well when something horrible happens. Ends up in the hole and has to find his way out without the benefit of most of those gifts and/or benefactor to “earn” the new status quo.


CheeTaHOO7

Yeah, you're right. Let's say their work is more "artistic" and I accept that MCU is beneath them. But why comment such harshly? "Copy/paste"? Tell me that it's not offensive to the people who are working their ass off to produce these films and I bet a lot of them are pretty passionate about them as well. It's the same with CGI argument. I mean I agree they do follow some kind of formula but doesn't literally every movie/genre? Also, I bet he hasn't even seen half of them. Should've just avoided the question because these media outlets wants exactly this. Some kind of reaction from these big director about MCU to get clicks from audience and it's even better if it's negative.


boooooshdingo

I mean I enjoy marvel movies but he is right. They have a formula to go right down the middle to please the largest number almost similar to how boy bands or pop music is extremely engineered for sales. Besides a few movies most are fairly interchangeable. The villians are some of the weakest aspects, everyone is the comic relief. Again I enjoy the movies but I'm also not blind to what they are. Its essential the mcds of movies. It's good most of the time but far from a 3 Michelin star meal. And there's nothing wrong with that. I think it's more people dont like being told what is art or what is commercial. People hold what they hold dearly. If someone likes pop and you tell them hey that artist had a whole team around them making the music specifically catered based on test audiences and expensive marketing, to sell to the highest amount they become upset. Some make movies for a wider spectrum, some make movies for a very niche spectrum. If Robert Downey jr can agree with Scorsese commentary on marvel and accept what the movies are, entertaining pop corn movies, then we all can accept a director's or actor opinion on the marvel franchise and not allow it to ruin your day or go up in arms. Just my .02


Thor_2099

People keep saying formula. Wtf is this formula. Release good movies? They follow a hero's journey. There's unexpected twists and turns along the way but *shock* the heroes win


boooooshdingo

Ok, you seemed confused by my statement. So I'll elaborate. Marvel movies follow a formula. Similar to a way that pop music follows a formula. Every detail is looked at to be across the board middle. So compare pop music to let's say metal. Pop is not only having 12 top and chorus writer but engineers, sound engineers, marketing, testing audiences to make sure it sells the most. Its literally a formula used for the success of that track being released. Wheres as metal will not go anywhere near into the amount of paint by numbers approach for sales. Marvel does this very similarly to the pop industry. Again not a bad thing but dont be fooled there is a massive formula to making these movies. Also I'm a marvel fan but saying all.marvel movies are good is laughable. Which villians out of the 24 movies so far do you remember their arc, backstory and motivation? I mean, everything's "The Hero's Journey"/Monomyth if you take the ridiculously broad view of what that encompasses. For example, where is the Refusal of the Call in Captain America? He's basically sitting by the phone for half the movie waiting on his callback. You don't really see it in Iron Man, either. But then people seem to have decided that any given part of the Hero's Journey is admissably skipped as long as you can still identify one or more elements of it being present, so by that extremely generous definition: sure, the Marvel franchise and every movie is solely the heroes journey. Again I like marvel movies but you shouldn't get offended when someone challenges your personal opinion of a franchise.


Imaginary-Fun-80085

>For example, where is the Refusal of the Call in Captain America? He's basically sitting by the phone for half the movie waiting on his callback. You don't really see it in Iron Man, either. This sounds like you're not agreeing that marvel movies are copy pasted as these movies have put a twist on the heroes journey. Some aren't heroes and some aren't "called to action" Instead they seek the action.


brightwings00

Adding to this: they're family-friendly comic book movies that inhabit a shared universe. Of course there's going to be some overlap. Are people like this angling for an R-rated political thriller surrounding a sex scandal, or... Don't get me wrong, I can definitely see a lot of the same storytelling beats and tropes in each movie, but some of this feels like going to a burger chain and complaining that they don't serve sushi.


arluck84

r/oddlyspecific


haikuprotocol

Would it not be the same as saying all romcoms,(as well as gangster, horror, buddy, cop etc.) movies are cut and paste? That's what a genre is... Got nerve considering he's doing a remake. The issue they don't understand, is that the suoerhero genre used to be bad and now it's amazing.


Bardivan

Anyone who cares about this is a little bitch dork


Khun-Pugwash

So anyway, I started blasting.


gucci-sprinkles

No need for a flame war but who does he think is going to make up the majority of his audience for dune? It's not exactly wise to chop your demographic in half. It's like the ghost busters thing all over again except not as bad in my opinion.


phuckthatguy

A lot of these news outlets are making this more than it needs to be. Please don’t fall for it.


Glasscubething

This. It’s a poorly translated line out of a full interview occurring in French. Give him a break, he was making a more nuanced point using marvel as an example. It wasn’t like some attempt to bash it.


GonzoRouge

Do you have a link to the interview in French ?


Midnight_Swampwalk

I've read the article (well, a translation of it). Do i have your permission to not like what he said now?


Trunks252

99% of all movies are remakes, sequels, or copies


jennana100

My art teacher would say "everything is a remix".


baron_iird123

Just like all books are remixes of the dictionary


StNic54

"That's a made-up word!"


DBreakStuff

All words are made up.


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DBreakStuff

But phrase is really a word.


De_immortalesloki

Depends on who you're asking


MyFriendThatherton

Embiggen is a perfectly cromulant word.


Zzzzzzzzzzip

The dictionary is just a select few pages of [the library of babel](https://libraryofbabel.info/). Actually everything is just a few pages of that...


baron_iird123

You learn something new everyday


Zzzzzzzzzzip

My [favorite page](https://libraryofbabel.info/bookmark.cgi?,r.pgmanapbclcdnjbfpx.lc147)


SaltyJake

I forgot about that video! Everyone should see it honestly before claiming any kind of foul over originality or shared IP.


RedditIsPropaganda84

Hollywood prefers to invest into proven ideas that already have a fanbase. If it's an original movie it will probably have some big names attached. Too risky otherwise.


mofoofinvention

Yeah, so is dune!


ACubeInABox

…His Dune isn’t a remake, sequel, or copy. It’s an adaptation of the book, of which only one movie (A rather inaccurate movie too) has been made. He’s making a once in a generation epic that might flop because (Among other variables) the MCU has become the one stop shop for cinema by appropriating other genres, meaning most original or new movies rarely break out. Imagine if The Fellowship of the Ring got kneecapped in it’s third week because the *26th* wildly successful MCU movie came out, all of which are hits regardless of quality, and then you couldn’t make The Two Towers and Return of the King to your Best Picture nomination. That’s what we might be dealing with here.


garhdo

Difference is Two Towers and Return of the King had already been filmed and so would definitely have been released. The second half of Villeneuve's Dune hasn't been filmed yet however, so yes we might not get a completed story if it flops.


ACubeInABox

Exactly, LOTR was lucky enough to be filmed back to back. Dune 2 and 3 are riding on this one.


garhdo

Only 2. He's not making a third apparently, or I'd he does it will be a sequel novel adaptation, not Dune.


MentallyHandicapd

"appropriating other genre's" damn bro, I was just listening to hip-hop with jazz influences, didn't know the artist was appropriating jazz there, I really should re-think mixing genre's as a whole because that is triggering and problematic.


ACubeInABox

The MCU appropriates other genres (Ant-Man-heist, Homecoming-teen comedy, Thor: Ragnarok-comedy, MoM-horror) to keep their movies fresh and different enough from each other. This in itself is not bad, it’s actually super clever and great for Kevin Feige and co. What’s bad is that the general audience now doesn’t watch movies outside of the MCU because the MCU has all the genres (Albeit put through the Marvel lens). So in your scenario, this would mean the jazz industry has started dying because the larger and much more popular hip hop industry pulled a jazz riff, which in turn gave the audience the feel of a jazz song, meaning there’s no reason to listen to a *real* jazz song.


Ryuubu

This just in: big movies perform better than small movies in the box office


ZenRx

Unless it’s an adaptation.


jakkyskum

I mean, he’s right. Doesn’t mean they’re bad, but they certainly follow a formula.


radiocomicsescapist

Yeah I love MCU but objectively, we should recognize there is an explicit formula that Feige and co. ensure every movie follows. Heck, every time a movie goes against the grain, we openly discuss and praise it on here


ThickLibrarian92

I mean I don't watch them expecting it to be some grand masterpiece everytime. they are simple action/super hero movies and there's nothing wrong with that


Fries-Ericsson

There is nothing wrong with that But you can acknowledge that and then think Dennis and Marty are wrong with their opinions.


Ganadote

I agree. It’s just funny how a lot of these directors probably love all those copy and paste westerns.


Eastern_Spirit4931

Then again most filmmakers are formulaic. Tarantino follows a formula so does Nolan.


f_manzoid

Difference is the MCU is all different directors, so if they all feel the exact same way, then thats a problem because it means the true talents of all the unique directors arent being allowed to shine


So-_-It-_-Goes

He even said he likes them in the same interview.


jakkyskum

That’s what kills me. This kind of clickbaity shit is ridiculous.


gigium1

Well it is not a remake of the past movie but an adaptation of the book 🤷🏻‍♂️


Hal9M

Denis Villeneuve is a great director and I've loved every movie he's made. I also love Marvel movies. So what if he's not a fan? He's entitled to his opinion. Also, not a remake of the 80s movie, it's a new adaptation of the book which the 80s movie is also adapted from.


DOGSraisingCATS

And most agree poorly adapted. If any great Science fiction novel needed a new adaptation, it was Dune.


hatedComments

I love David Lynch, he's a genius, but whatafuck he did with dune?


Bunraku_Master_2021

Post-Production screwed it up.


TensorForce

Not to be that guy, but Dune is an adaptation of the original book. It's not based on the previous movie, so it's not a remake. We have 3 different Spiderman series, they're all reboots yes, no remakes.


toocoldtotype

Just curious, Was the previous 1984 Dune movie an adaptation of Original book or was it loosely based ?


puddingfoot

It's an adaptation. Not a great one, but it's recognizably Dune.


NJ_Legion_Iced_Tea

Also the iconic line "The spice must flow" isn't from any of the books, it was from the movie.


duramman1012

I mean hes not wrong. I love Marvel movies dont get me wrong. There’s few marvel movies i dont like but theres no doubt they all fit a certain formula. Thats what makes them consistent but they definitely have a mold that every movie fits


012789x

These are movies made with the intention of cash grab. I don't know how people can just ignore that


AHMilling

Really looking forward to his dune, after he did so amazing with blade runner.


BarnabyWillis

Is he wrong?


ProWarlock

seriously? this again? can't people just enjoy and dislike these movies freely without the other side getting bent out of shape? christ


[deleted]

Nope. Nowadays it's either go along with everyone or get blasted for your differing views


LilQuasar

you can dislike something without insulting / disrespecting it


ProWarlock

I don't think he was really disrespecting it, he literally just offered a criticism. he said in the same interview wandavision and some of the other content is breaking the mold. he's just pointing out a flaw in most of the movies


Nothingaddsup

And it's a criticism that most the fanbase have too. "The first villain is just an evil version of the new hero" has been a common complaint since phase 2 at least.


ProWarlock

if it's such a common complaint then why are we complaining about Denis saying it lmfao


ACubeInABox

Because we’re r/marvelmemes, we’re not exactly the brightest of the bunch over here.


reallyConfusedPanda

You must think criticism is a form of insult


012789x

I disagree with this statement. Sometimes you need to insult something to steer the general public away from what you believe to be a negative influence


mofoofinvention

So his dune will be original?


DBreakStuff

It's an adaptation of the book.


mofoofinvention

Exactly


andoriyu

If you bring that argument, should I introduce you to comic books? 80s Dune was very inaccurate adoption of a book. Plus, that's besides the point because book (novel or comics) adaptations aren't copy-paste and repeat. And that's like 1 book with 2 movies in multiple decades. Marvel popped content just this year. Marvel movies on the other hand... Aside from almost all of them following Hero's cycle, they follow a very similar patter to each other at the same pace. If you have seen one of them, you have seen most of them. It's a fact, they follow a box office proven formula. You either like or not - I do, but I recognize that they are repetitive and there is nothing wrong with it.


Powersoutdotcom

Rekt


Born_of_Bronze

So?


makemeking706

Yet another adaptation of the book.


blueB0wser

"Yet another", it's only had 2 successful film adaptations and a miniseries. One adaptation was from 1984, the other is the new one, and the miniseries was from the 2000s. It's literally a once in a generation kind of film. Edit: I see I struck a nerve here.


YourOneWayStreet

Why are you counting the unreleased one under discussion here and referring to it in the past tense


IAMATruckerAMA

thats the joke dot jaypeg


Elite2260

Now, I don’t see that— however Shang Chi had many similar plot points or ideas that were already shown in black widow.


Panamos

Basically every hero movie follows the [Heroes Journey Formula](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hero%27s_journey). You can easily apply it to Shang Chi. Heavy Spoiler Alert - only continue if you’ve seen Shang Chi!!! This also might ruin hero movies for you. >! Call to Adventure: His father wants to destroy his mother’s village and he wants to protect it. !< >! Super Natural Help: Morris helps him into the other world. !< >! Threshold: He enters the other dimension. !< >! He finds a mentor in his aunt. !< >! He finds a helper in the rest of the village who fights besides him. !< >! Abyss: He fights with his father and sinks into the lake. The monster is freed. !< >! Rebirth: He awakens the dragon, who lifts him out of the lake. !< >! Transformation: He fights his father and claims the power of the ten rings. !< >! Atonement: He chooses not to kill his father and defeats the monster. !< >! Return with the gift of the goddess: Returns with the ten rings. !< >! I know I ignored the whole part until he his captured by his father, but all up to that point is imo exposition. !<


metathesis

This is what I needed to see here. Story structures have some very popular frameworks that are very common. Hero's journey, Positive change arc, fall arc, flat arc, origin story, a Cinderella story, revenge epics, team-ups, even just comedy or tragedy there are formula beats to all of them. And in a specific genre there are more popular patterns. They're popular because story structure is actually something that matters to making stories good, they have to hold the story up. Want a concrete example, revenge epics. Braveheart was Gladiator, was John Wick, was Kill Bill. In many ways, but not all. Every time people start to see the structural similarities though they get all weird about it.


Panamos

I think people get weird about it because it might seem like lazy screen writing. But when a story doesn’t follow one of these formulas it is often perceived as boring or less satisfying.


metathesis

I think it's important to deviate enough that it's not totally predictable. But it's ok to hit familiar beats as long as the actual thematic content is fairly original. I think it's when the characters are pretty unoriginal or the themes they grapple with are not very compelling, that's when a standard format movie really fails to shine whatsoever. But if those parts are good, I could care less if it's structure I've seen a million times. It'll still work.


burndtdan

But even given all of that, I haven't seen a Marvel movie >!where an actual dragon fights a Cthulu-looking soul eating demon!< before. There's no cut and paste of other Marvel movies there.


Panamos

Definitely. I still watch most Marvel Movies even though I know they follow a formula. They are still cool and have amazing CGI.


Nothingaddsup

He doesn't mean they are exact carbon copies of one another, just that the framework is pretty much the same across most of the films, especially if it's the first film of a new series.


locampo173

Shang Chi, Ragnarok, and Black Panther are pretty much the same movie when it comes to the final battle


VonVard

He's right though


phalanx004

I fucking hate the internet, in this place everything is either a 10/10 or a 1/10. There is no middle ground. Why can't we just accept that good things can have bad and bad things can be good. Why can't we criticize things we like? And praise things we hate? No, on the internet it's either a like or a dislike, an upvote or a downvote. And you wonder why people go apeshit when a game is given a deserved 7or6/10 instead of an overbloated 9. The internet cannot understand grayness. Marvel can be the greatest thing or the death of cinema. On the internet reason is a foreign concept. Fuck the internet All the edits were false postings... my phone is acting up.


PickledPlumPlot

I think the worst thing about fandom is how everyone is really defensive about things. The franchise already made 22 billion dollars, no need to jump to its defense every time someone high-profile says something mildly bad about it. It's fine to like these movies and it's fine to dislike these movies.


HelpMeGetAName

He made a new adaptation which is very different from the older one.


NoBonusNachos

God damn why can’t Marvel fans just like the movies and not worry about EVERY single person who says anything slightly negative about them.


ShibasInSuits

He's right


3headedsalsa

Edit/ Sorry for the harsh words! I respect Villeneuve as a director, and I realize headlines like this are designed to bring out the worst in people. I just hope a quote like this won't be used as ammunition against me for enjoying superhero movies.


kurapikachu64

I mean that is the double side of it. On one hand, yeah these quotes aren't a big deal, and honestly there's some truth into them. I don't agree with claims that they aren't "cinema", but these movies are clearly made to be profitable and entertaining to mainstream audiences. They are usually very formulaic popcorn movies. So what if some other celebrity doesn't think highly of that? If we enjoy them that's all that matters. On the other hand, this mindset is absolutely used as ammunition against the "sheep" that love these films, like you said. And these claims definitely feed that. Judge the movies all you want, but once the implications start coming out about the audience for them it's pretty unnecessary and honestly just shitty. Most of these quotes don't attack the fans, at least not overtly, but in general I've seen more people talk shit about marvel fans than I have seen marvel fans get butthurt over these quotes.


ILOVEMCU

Why is his head in his ass on this? I don’t see how. He was asked a question I’m sure and he answered. It would be fake to pretend not to have an opinion on the current biggest Hollywood giant.


3headedsalsa

Hi! I edited my original post to more or less reflect this, but I'm afraid that was a rather spur of the moment comment on my part. Sadly it would seem I am not as immune to criticism of something I hold dear as I would like to think 😅


LilQuasar

someone translated the relevant part of the interview and it was nothing like that. dont be sure without evidence next time


ZenRx

Is it a remake or an adaptation?


3headedsalsa

I've seen it be called both online. Being that I haven't seen the new one yet, I don't think I the right person to ask at this point! I guess it's closer to the novel than Lynch's version was from what I've seen in trailers, so adaptation would probably be more apt.


roywarner

It's literally no different than the marvel movies which are adapting decades of source material for the screen


ZenRx

I’m not arguing one way or the other BUT is there really an issue where a rat releases ant man from the quantum verse. Forgive me. I don’t know the terminology.


juh4z

>but this guy needs to get his head out of his ass. No, you need to. He is right, most marvel movies are almost the same. You can still like them, I still like them, but they are, denying it is stupid, ignorant and a fanboy move. He doesn't want to send Feige to "copy and paste jail", it's just another case of "people asked what x person thought about MCU movies, they responded", he isn't actively hating on anything, people asked, he responded, that's it, every bloody time someone says anything remotely negative about anything MCU related we get fanboys like yourself who seem incapable of understanding they're not nearly flawless just because you like them, grow up.


GenericGaming

Yeah, because when I was watching Ant-Man and The Wasp, the first thing that came into my head was "geez, this film seems exactly like Thor: The Dark World" /s


soy_boy_69

Fair enough. But when I watched Guardians of the Galaxy I did think "this is just Avengers with a fun soundtrack." When I watched Dr Strange I thought "this is Ironman with magic instead of metal suits." When I watched Antman I thought "this is Ironman with shrinking."


3headedsalsa

I'm sorry I offended you! I didn't mean to come off as overly negative, I'm just worried that quotes from directors like Villeneuve will give high brow critics more reason to bash me for 'fangirling' about movies that are very near and dear to my heart. I enjoy the Marvel movies, yes. I can also acknowledge they're not as original as something like Casablanca, or even Dune! I just wish people would stop using quotes from big name directors to hate on me for enjoying a popcorn flick. I definitely could have worded that with more nuance in my original reply, thanks for pointing that out!


Crusader25

I mean, he's not wrong... Iron Man/Ant-Man/Dr. Strange are all the same movie with the proper nouns switched around lol. Dune looks like the kind of Epic Sci-Fi that comes around once a decade, if we're lucky


Nazzo_

Finally someone who really understood what he said. The whole thing and not just something taken out of context. And at least someone admits that there is a "Marvel formula"


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windraver

Copy paste money is still money. In the next shocking news, many movies are copy paste of books.


roywarner

Including his


masterjon_3

He's not wrong, there is a formula for some movies. "If you do this thing, it'll be bad for you." "OK, I won't do the thing" \*Bad guy is too strong\* "I'm going to do the thing to save the day"


Bohhhh-

He’s sort of right: marvel movies after ten years can get pretty repetitive, that’s why they need some directors good enough to implement their own style, peculiar features or give personality to the movie. It’d be getting sort of boring to watch the usual origin story/ stand alone/ massive team up etcetera. That’s why ragnarok, guardians of the galaxy 1,2 and winter soldier were great, ragnarok and guardians of the galaxy were heavily influenced by their respective directors, and what made winter soldier great was the fact that it was a more fantapolitic spy story ( sort of like a jason bourne movie), not the usual “good guy has a moral obligation to fight evil, he knows exactly since the beginning who the villain is, and after a loss/ defeat, they’ll whoop their enemy’s asses “


J4kyBoi

Yeah, one thing one my friends are saying is that Dune is trying to copy Star Wars when it was Star Wars that copied Dune (the book came before both movies)


Bunraku_Master_2021

Oh, the irony. And Lucas was inspired by Akira Kurosawa's The Hidden Fortress, Nixon's America, and the aesthetics of Nazi Germany as key influences for the first film.


KingSuj

oh my god who cares


zouzouille9

He said "most of them", which is quite right. And it is ecolving more and more. Don't read comicbook.com titles, they are very misleading just to gather views.


H_Arthur

Marvel films will never be taken seriously if you guys don’t criticize the actual filmmaking and acting involved. Loki was one of the worst acted things I’ve ever seen spat out from Marvel. Stop worshiping every single film or show. Consume this media like a normal person. Believe it or not, there are terribly made Marvel comics out there.


lofgren777

I am still not convinced that Loki wasn't a meta self parody.


1HalfBloodPrince

But did he lie?


FloydZero

It's funny how petulantly defensive some people on this sub gets


obscurereference234

Calling somebody else’s work “cut and paste” is a bad look when you’re literally promoting a movie that someone else already made.


Ahrimanic-Trance

Lol highly doubt his Dune will be anywhere even close to Lynch’s, but that would require knowing anything about either work compared to the book. Also, it’s really funny how MCU fanboys are reacting to this when you were all just saying exactly this about Black Widow. Comic book movies in general *are* pretty copy and paste and then when someone deviates it’s fucking madness and everyone gets a pitchfork. We’re also talking about movies based on a medium that’s been copy and pasting both from themselves and from others literally forever. Makes me wonder what you guys think of shit like Deadpool. I bet that was a good copy and paste for you.


Crusader25

Have you read Dune? Ever seen the movie from the 80s? Any Director will have a \*TON\* of creative freedom adapting this story (that for years has been considered impossible to adapt to film).


Competitive-King-119

the argument is that its extremely hard to come up with an original movie plot because they all follow certain established tropes and moves and character designs, etc. story telling and movie making is a science with its own rules. he is basically saying that mcu is playing by the most established (also profitable?) rules. He can have all the control he wants but whatever he makes is not a completely original work. And there is nothing wrong with that. Even early painters understood that art is about using other people's work and making it your own. \*insert the famous quote about stealing art\* Edit: interesting to see this comment go from upvoted to downvoted. i wonder what people disagree with? Btw, Denis is probably in my top 3 favorite directors of all time.


Crusader25

Fair. Permit me to be a bit of a smart-ass here, but i'm not sure why Marvel fans are even upset about this. Their directors aren't exactly creating these characters :P I think Denis has a bit of a leg to stand on with where he's coming from, however. Dune is this genre-defining watershed sci-fi novel that hasn't had a definitive adaptation into film. Hell, it doesn't even show up as a blip on the radar for cultural relevance in 2021, so Denis getting the chance to direct one is probably massively fulfilling to him as an artist (he was a big fan before being signed on to Direct).


Competitive-King-119

>Fair. Permit me to be a bit of a smart-ass here, but i'm not sure why Marvel fans are even upset about this. Their directors aren't exactly creating these characters :P all of the top comments on most threads ive seen today share your opinion.


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[удалено]


Dimfacion

And a sequel and another book adaptation, ...


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not-sure-if-serious

That's what marvel movies are. I don't see a problem with it. Good guys win, nods to the comics and meta stuff. Nothing wrong with that. Dune movie looks good too.


ParamedicSpecific130

You can do both. Chloe Zhao made Nomadland and Eternals.


Goku047

I like marvel movies and denis villeneuve's movies. Does it matter what one of these thinks of the other as long as I, as an audience enjoys both ?


Vaeon

Not only did he do a remake, but his [first trailer is *literally* a shot-for-shot remake.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcZPZGq3Zy8)


TheUnknownUsarr

He is right tho. How many remakes did spider man get?


Godsfallen

I’m a huge MCU fan, but he’s not wrong. They all follow the same formula. Also he didn’t even say this randomly or say it was a negative. He was asked how he felt about them and answered honestly. Also Dune is an adaptation of the Frank Herbert novel, not a remake.


BewBewsBoutique

And Harry Potter is a cut and paste of the Bible


randomguy12358

And the matrix


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dino_spitting_fax

Good bot.


strawberrybrooks

Never understood all the disdain for superhero movies. 100 years of comics couldn't achieve what 10 years of the MCU has. These days the average person feels beaten down and overwhelmed by the world's evils and injustices, craving hope and excitement. Every genre comes and goes in waves, but with modern CGI and Hollywood budgets making these flicks look incredibly realistic with great actors, production teams, and widely positive themes and morals... Clearly now is the time for some goddamn superheroes


blueB0wser

The disdain comes from "superhero fatigue", which, yeah, I understand. Marvel and DC pumped movies out on a yearly basis, so people just stopped being as excited for them.


malm9010

To be honest, the comics do tell the same stories but with more depth. Not saying that the comics are perfect but neither are the movies.


strawberrybrooks

Yeah I totally get that, I mean on the levels of global hype, awareness and impact. The nerds and comic readers of the world had always been shunned before it all came to the big screen, now it's a huge part of society


sam002001

Idk man I'd prefer some politicians who aren't completely corrupt but maybe that's just me


strawberrybrooks

Ok, I mean me too, but what's your point here? That taking money out of the film industry, or stopping Marvel movies to make more rom-coms will somehow end political corruption? Which has existed since we first came out of caves?


LilQuasar

thats less realistic than superheroes


Haryzen_

I mean he's not wrong but it's not the story structure of individual Marvel films that make it so popular. It's the different characters and continuity over 23 films, 3 D+ Shows and more to come. Nobody is calling the MCU high art on the level of BR2049 or Arrival, but they are well made films with good action, good writing (mostly) and an emotional centre behind each one.


MakeYourselfS1ck

Marvel fanboys so triggered cause they are cookie cutter movies except a few exceptions


ElDavisho9

Who cares?


Lnx9

Looks like someone wants free marketing


WearyKaleidoscope976

This is such a comeback


incrediblePsychoheaD

Quite easy PR. But i heard Dune is really well done.


sippin40s

I absolutely hate this post. It's an adaptation of a book that has basically nothing to do with the David Lynch Dune, so this is just misleading. Denis is one the best directors working too, like this makes Marvel fans look stupid


Jamesottr

If you seen Shang chi he kinda has a point, all the marvel movies do kinda follow the same format but somewhat a little different, but Shang chi was so bland and predictable


BigResolution5107

Isn't this Dune movie the 3rd adaption of the 56 year old novel? 🤔


ZenRx

He’s remaking a book into a movie